Ideas

"Find that Masterpiece" is, of course, a working title.

Naming suggestions are more than welcome :)

I like this idea. The users could create and maintain a dynamic list of locations for each piece or collection of art. I think museums themselves would also be interested in keeping the list up to date as it might attract visitors to their museums.

I imagine this to be like typing the name of a piece of art in the search field Wikipedia, like Van Gogh's sun flowers and then being presented with a user-editable list of locations for that exact piece. At the top of the list would be the newest known location the piece will be located at a specific date range and further down the list perhaps the older locations. (As a sort of history of visited places)

Exactly. It would be the same thing as going to a band's site and checking out tour dates. You'd be able to view all the places it should go in the next months/years.

iLike.com has an interesting feature on that, they allow its users to add new dates but differentiate between "user inputed" and "official" data, making it easier for people to know which dates are really confirmed.

u-lik.com is another interesting reference - people have their own profiles listing interests and "objects" (people/music/movies) they rated. And each "object" has a specific page with extra information and connections to other "objects". it's a very nice way to find recommendations on works that might interest the user.

Thanks for your suggestions, zentropy.

I really like what you are trying to accomplish. As an collector, I should think that such a site would be very interesting.

Good Luck, please keep me posted as to your progress.

This is a really interesting idea. I think if you could convince some major museums and art galleries to help contribute it'd save a lot of time, and provide advertising for them. I can see this being a popular site.

That's one of the ideas, and it's good to know people like you read the project and think of it right after.

Besides a place to promote their exhibits, this could an interesting networking environment for curators, art dealers and artists too.

And also a good channel to promote openings, guided tours, to hold contests, so many possibilities :)

Thanks for the suggestion, Laura.

So, where do you get the data from to track this?

Well, the same way every social network does - from its users. It would be interesting to start off with official information from the widely known museums and galleries. Much of this information is available online and its just a matter of establishing an effective communication channel with their PR. Whether it is making them interested in providing and adding the data themselves or by making it work as an interesting advertising tool and have a team specialized in updating this info at a certain cost.

But, of course, Im open to suggestions as to what are the most effective ways of keeping users (Im considering individuals and companies as users here) engaged and active.

If you have a better idea, Id love to hear it.

I love the idea. You might want to think about different areas. Instead of focusing on just visual art, you might have visual, performing arts, concerts (indie or mainstream), etc. If you broaden your user base, you'll be more likely to succeed.

The name that came into my mind was "artopedia" because this is such a typical thing to do with a wiki, and guess what:
http://www.artopedia.org/
Exist and seems to do just what you want, but without the social network. I think that's fine because it means the border too give input is much lower.
Tommy

I think this is a good idea. My first inclination is that it's a very small market, but the "long tail" theory says that's not necessarily a bad thing. I'm not a big art fan but there are a couple of artists whose work I'd make an effort to see if I had a way of knowing where it was.

I think the addition of a "suggest similar" that you mention would be a big attraction and fairly easy to implement if you track preference ratings of other users (just like Amazon shows the "people who bought this also bought" upsell list).

From a usability standpoint, what sort of interface to you have in mind? You could do this as a wiki indexed by author or a more custom interface that allowed more drilldown by author and title.

@Nickonomics101

Great point. I imagine, even if we did restrict (not the case) the kind of work, users would eventually end up broadening the range of inputs. I was thinking about that in different terms yesterday - would a Kidrobot (http://www.kidrobot.com) exhibit, for instance, be eligible for tracking? Are these objects artworks or simply toys? In my view, the broader the concept or art we work with, the better - we'll attract different people with different interests :)

@vanhees

Artopedia is only an encyclopedia, actually. If you try to look for an artwork, you'll see there are no specific pages for them. Not even for museums. They're focused on information on artists and art movements, which is not what we're doing here (we might even add the movements as tagging options, but just to make it easier for people to find new art they're likely to be interested in).

Artcyclopedia (http://www.artcyclopedia.com), in the other hand, allows you to look for artists, museums and artworks (some, mostly paintings and the classical ones, nothing contemporary), but it's also more of a research tool. What you get as result is some links and images.

What I have in mind is something closer (structurally) to what u-lik (www.u-lik.com) is. If you look at their "The Starry Night" (http://club.u-lik.com/club.php?o=51917) page (they call it a "club"), you'll see there's a great difference between the 'profile' of that piece (static info, the big white box with the title and picture) and dynamic info (ratings, people who like it, people who don't, 'similar 'items', related products and even a chat box). That's closer to what this social network would look like.

There's a great difference between reading information about an artwork or being linked to a museum that represents that artist and finding people who like that piece, people who don't and, especially, people who love close to the place it will be next.

So, 'Artopedia' is a great sounding name, easy to remember, but tricks people into thinking of this service in a way which is not what it does. It is not focused in providing (only) descriptions, but in letting people know where to find those pieces in the real world.

Thank you very much for your suggestions :)

micco,

I you focus only in the artwork tracking 'service' it would appear to be a small market, but provided people will have the chance to meet new people with similar interests, it could be a valuable tool for exchanging information (for students and travelers), networking (artists and sealers) and promotion (museums and galleries), i see it as a a focused but big market. And depending on the range of artwork classification we include (Kidrobot example above), we might even add a few other people.

On the interface, i think the u-lik example above might answer your question. Let me know if it doesn't.

And since you mentioned interface, there are infinite choices for a front page too - we can focus on the search feature or on profiling the highest rated works/artists/galleries -, but I think it's be more truthful to the networks' 'essence' if we focused on current events - openings, recommended exhibits (by staff members and by prominent users), and news-related features too (an artwork that was recently stolen, we could make a joke on "where do you think this one is going next?", for instance). That way, people would really get the feeling the network is more "alive" than static.

What do you think?

--

p.s.: Sorry on the badly formatted links above:
http://www.kidrobot.com
http://www.artcyclopedia.com
http://club.u-lik.com/club.php?o=51917

I you focus > If you focus
a valuable > an invaluable, a great
a a focused but big > a specific but big

Works for me. I remember finding out - by accident - that Lempicka was showing in London. I only found out because a guy in StumbleUpon said: "Hey! You like this artist, don't you? Did you see the article in today's paper...".

It has continued to work that way for me: "You're in SF, right? You know about the Olafur Eliasson show?"

I'd surely love to be able to say: I want to see more Lempicka's, and I'm going here, here, and here. Or, I like this, this and this, and I'm going to be here: what shouldn't I miss?

Thank you for your answer.
Tommy

This might be really easy to get going as a wiki. There are a lot of wiki services out there, and I believe I've seen at least one somewhere with a calender plugin. There's probably some way to integrate google maps as well.

Thanks, CH :)

Laura, there surely are inexpensive ways to build a community with these features. But the thing about using already existing services is that the community positioning would not be really clear - people might think it is a real wiki with extra features.

And being perceived as a different service it key here. I think the more "social" it feels - fluid information instead of static 'updateable' information (which is the care of wikis), the more intuitively people will be able to use it.

Wikis usually are used for checking information or learning about a certain subject. And this would be a place to exchange information, meet people, make contacts, organize and promote events, and even to release new artists.

Thanks for your suggestion, btw. Its really important to know what needs to be made clear so people won't "confuse" this network with other services. The sooner you know what differentiates you, the better :)

it key > is key
the care > the case

sorry :)

I think you could easily add the social features you want on top of a wiki structure. If you think about it, MySpace is really a wiki with very specific editing privileges. I certainly wouldn't suggest letting the back-end framework drive the design of what the service should be, but if you can find an existing framework like a wiki or a CMS, then you can leverage that to prevent reinventing the wheel on basic services and focus on your innovative bits.

So I probably put the cart before the horse by talking about frameworks. I was just trying to get a mental picture of what you had in mind, and I tend to think in terms of database structures. You should probably sketch out how you envision the site layout working and then see if that matches a common design you could reuse.

I also tend to recommend things to get things going quickly - for an initial prototype, say. The development time to create a custom platform often sinks a lot of good ideas into oblivion, so I've been trying to recommend that businesses use existing services to get the ball rolling, with the plan of upgrading/converting to something more specialized later on.

Invertebra:

How is this better than having a gallery/exhibition in second life?

Nice idea.

You have to d/l a client for second life. If this was done online it would have way more many people to participate. It could even have a Facebook app where people could share/buy their favorite art.

@ laura & micco

I know what you mean and I agree it's not wise to spend time developing something if you already have similar tools available to base your creation on. I think it's just a matter of testing and seeing how people react/interact to it.

It will be a matter of balance between innovating/getting things done in the end, because questions like Wiz4rd's make somewhat concerned if this will be an easy concept to understand or if people will have different expectations and be disappointed by it. And the interface plays a major role at that perception.

Also, discussing interface right now itsn't putting the cart before the horse. It's actually the one thing that needs to be done and perfected as quickly as possible, because only then, the network can be tested, and we can build a consistent userbase to turn Art-a-Track into an interesting advertising investment for galleries and museums. So your thoughts are really helpful.

@ Wiz4rd

So Wiz4rd, this is not intended to be exactly a gallery. From the regular user/non artist's perspective, the main feature would be allowing them to find the art they are interested in and knowing where to find it - in the real world. Be it a masterpiece in a museum or contemporary art in a gallery, for instance. Even street art. And they'd be able to subscribe to these works (to find their whereabouts) and be recommended new artists, works and places to visit based on their tastes.

And from artists/dealers/business people perspective (which is what I think you were referring to with your question, right?), this place is meant to showcase their art and events, yes, but it isn't intended to "be" a gallery. The main reason people would subscribe to an artist/an artwork/etc wouldn't be just to see the art online, but to know how to find the pieces in the real world or to receive news on that artist. And for

Also, the artists will have a place to network, meet other creatives, contact curators and gallery owners. So, in a way, it would share similarities with a Second Life gallery (in the sense you can actually see images of the artworks and read info about them), but it would be more focused on the "news" aspect of the artworld, on engaging people to like, to see and to find out what's going on in the artworld in their 'real' lifes: to visit a museum, to message an artist, to buy an art magazine with an interesting feature.

So, as Emesee already put in other words: It is focused on a different (broader, also) audience: it's not meant to be a game, it won't oblige you to download anything or build a character or even interact, of you don't want to. People will be able to simply subscribe to their favorite feeds if that's what they're interested in.

The Facebook app is a good idea, Emesee.

Thanks a lot, everyone, for voting also. It took me a while to answer this time, but I'm happy this is getting really positive feedback :)

Hi rapaz, I like this idea also. Its very interesting. A sugestion, what you think to make a kind of world map and as a GPS (simulation) and add the places in real time where we can find the artists and paints around the world?

Um grande abraço e sucesso.

I definitely agree that interface is really important. Here's what I envision when I think of this idea - it may or may not match yours in any way, but perhaps it'll help clarify your vision.

"Artist" Profiles - A brief history of the artist, identifying their genre and linking to all the artwork associated with them on the site, with rankings showing what site visitors think of the art, and a google-maps mashup that shows where all their artwork can be seen. Artists could provide contact information/links to their own promotional material with some method of confirming who they are.

"Artwork" Profiles - For each piece, with a photo of the artwork and a place for discussion. Also a widget to allow the rating, and a submission system for updates to the locations.

Artwork should also be able to be tagged into 'collections' so that artwork that tends to move together between shows ( because they are owned by the same person/organization, forexample), so that updates can be more easily handled.

A search engine that allows searching by artist, theme (spring, children, landscape), genre (realism, cubism, whateverism), location (a must!), and perhaps other things relevant to art lovers (ei, art currently at auction or art recently in the news)

Personal profiles - everyone who logs in can set up a profile. This provides them with a map of artwork in their area, a way to bookmark 'favorite peices' (and have a feed that supplies them with updates).

Discussion starters: I'd recommend something like this for the home page, simply for community building and for people to come back. Pick two photos of similar subjects, and have people vote which one is better, with a space for commentary.

An art news feed.

I really like this idea. I was worried at first about the crowd information side of things because of the problems with getting out of date, but actually I think that can be avoided here. As long as when a painting is registered an end date to the exhibition is given, out-of-date information can be automatically expired and all is good.

Of course, you'd still want to add a disclaimer to the effect that anything found on the site is for information only; anyone considering travelling to see a particular painting/exhibition should contact the gallery in question to avoid disappointment. Or words to that effect.

Perhaps information obtained directly from gallery sources could be marked as such?

I quite like this idea, I would definatly use it, maybe even include current prices? for profitable work?

Art gets out of Date?

Also second life is difficult to navigate when you first log-in.

I also think that the personal homepage starts with a "browser." I like this, I like that, I live here, I don't like nighttime activities, i can apy a million or so for art... That way the user can build the art life they want.

(this is just to let you know it'll take me a couple of days until i can answer these last comments, but i will. thanks in advance for the collaboration.)

In the meantime:

- what do you think about a review feature for people to share their opinions on works/exhibits/artists?

- what features do you think would be unnecessary?

an if you'd be interested in participating in a discussion group about this project, let me know. i'd like to see how many people are actually interested in participating on the actual 'making this come to life', so if i have enough people, i'd be happy to start it off.

i wouldn't want to simply propose this as a business and just leave it there until people found it.

No, art doesn't go out of date. Information on which painting is in which exhibition/gallery goes out of date.

I like your idea, especially the social networking part. My brother is an artist and he has to rely on Skype, Gmail, MySpace etc. in order to get together with his buddies who happen to live and work all over the world. You can add value by creating a space for art people and helping them to promote their work. I feel that if itÂ's properly developed and presented, you should be able to attract the attention of the target community and the money. ItÂ's up to you to define the art community, it can be not only the artists, but also art-lovers, collectors etc.

Second life is too complex, there will be embedded 3d environs commonplace soon enough yet now ease of access for artist should be a priority.

Maybe you could create a 'map-view' so that artists can see all the art in their immediate area :o) - This could be especially useful for street art.

First of all, thank you all very much for your support and voting. I was incredibly happy to see Art-a-Track as the winner last week's round.

Your replies:

@Umagoo

Mapping the artworks would be essential, since the main 'service' here would be providing a virtual/real world information 'connection'.As for GPS, it's a great idea. If we could actually, later on, integrate the service with different 'real-world' navigation systems, it would be amazing. Thanks for your contribution.

@Laura

I think we're on the similar pages regarding artists, artwork and regular user 'profiles'. The more information you can find there the better. I think the biggest issue with these pages will really be the hierarchy - how to make it simple and easy to navigate - and the social character of the page - the more 'fluid' the page seems, the more inclined they'll be to contribute with info on their on (as opposed to the network feeling like an 'information channel').

Your 'collections' idea was a great insight. If it works as a tag, people would even be able to find and contact the 'owners' by their profiles easily (be it galleries, artists themselves, private owners etc.). And even own their own collections, if they're artists. This might be a complicated issue, though, because if the 'collection' concept is too broad, we might see a great amount of self-proclaimed artists linking their online art and flickr postings as art. So this should be really well thought out. But i like the idea very much.

Search engine is a must. It'll probebly be the most used feature on the site. We might be able to customize something with Google.

On your discussion starters, i think promoting an engaging activity on the front page a great idea. But as for the voting, I think we might be sending the wrong message as an art 'rating' site, and we really don't have the intention on classifying (or even finding out) which works are better or worse, but respect each user's taste and allow them to find artwork relevant to them. But i think your idea really can be tweaked into something that'd contribute to the community's information flow. I don't know, maybe somthing related to current news, or different activities every week... It's a good idea, though, thanks for sharing.

@PhilipH

Exactly, since every exhibit has an end date, the worst you'd expect to find at an artwork info page is 'currently unknown status' or something close to that. But since there are a lot of different 'official channels' that might be interested in participating, i think we might be able to have it updated at least when it comes to major cities/museums/artists. If we rely too much on regular users, we'd be bound to be updated only when it's, well, old news. so we'll do our best to have a direct channel with these institutions/professionals.

On the disclaimer idea, great tip. I think that could also feature into an agreement term users sign when they decide to register. Maybe. I don't know.
On making official/non-official info, we were discussing this in a previous comment - there's iLike as a good reference. I think they have an interesting format to make these differences clear.

Thanks a lot for your contribution.

@kairaspo

Prices, that's an interesting idea. Since many works go on auction every year, it'd be an interesting feature to connect people in the business or just as curiosity for regular users. Great, thanks for the insight.

@ MichaelM

PhilipH was talking about exhibit end dates. Not 'expiration; dates. But he answered that already :)

I get that you are referring to personal info on the profile page, but I don't really think I got your concept of 'browsing'. How does it differ from a regular user profile with all the info they've 'collected' throughout the community?

@ BizFunder

Exactly, we want to add virtually every possible type of 'real world' art (even those which the 'art' label might be questionable). And we do want to include 'well-established' art as well as 'newcoming' art, the challenge here is how to differentiate both. Because if we don't, we might make it harder (or make it a longer process) for people to find art they're interested in.

And yes, we're targeting on a very broad idea of 'audience', even travellers looking for interesting places to visit.

It seems we have an interesting amount of artists around here at CH. I'd love to see these people as our alpha testers once we get everything set.

Thanks for contributing.

@ Wiz4rd

Map view, yes. Umagoo suggested something GPS-related a few days ago, which is also interesting. Your map view idea kind of reminds me what they already do at Yelp. It's an interesting interface.

Maybe we'd need to have different environments - one for socializing/networking, one for finding art, one for organizing works spacially (a map area) etc. Otherwise there'are just so many possible (and necessary) features, we might end up confusing users.

Well, thanks a lot once again for your ideas and votes. We're on our first steps into developing the idea, so all suggestions are more than welcome. Feel free to comment here or contact me directly.